It’s gotten a lot better, as for

>I also don’t really like the Java library installation process that Sun provides, it feels clunky

Read my blog entry on that issue;
http://sellmic.com/blog/2007/05/16/easy-deployment-is-finally-here-session-my-notes/

There are two closely-related clientside logic languages which can drive Adobe Apollo applications: the ECMAScript-based ActionScript in Adobe Flash Player, and the ECMAScript-based JavaScript in the Webkit HTML browser. Apollo basically brings existing platform-neutral web apps to the desktop, with file privileges and other amenities available to full native-code applications.

If you prefer to write in Python or other serverside languages, and have these execute on the clientside machines, then it might be possible to do a static compile to an ECMAScript language, as opposed to the local runtime conversion to .NET code that Microsoft is offering. I’m still unclear, though, on the total costs of automating a language conversion, whether on the authoring machine, at the server, or on the final clientside machine — Google Web Toolkit, for instance, converts Java code to JavaScript, and I’m not certain yet how people feel about the overall efficiency and range of constructs such a process supports.

jd/adobe

Orcas isn not a requirement at all, I wrote my first silver light app in Notepad. In fact you go on to say you used Notepad++. You need the .NET 3.5 compilers if you want to write managed code, and they might only well come with Orcas at this stage, but that’s just for ease of deployment, not a long term effort.

“I quickly found out that there was no support for WPF Layouts, DockPanels, and ComboBoxs. What, not a basic control like a ComboBox?”

I couldn’t possibly comment on this, however I suspect that lack of controls could be short lived.

“However, to use these controls, I needed to build them. In order to build them, I needed Visual Studio Orcas — something I’m refusing to install.”

Well actually all you need is the C Sharp compiler (v3.5). I can however relate to this, Microsoft release the source code for lots of things but not compiled binaries which can be a pain.

“I’m also disappointed that it looks like Silverlight will only run inside the browser, like current Flash applications.”

That’s not the case, it’s just .NET.
http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/archive/2007/05/10/silverlight-console-applications.aspx
http://weblogs.asp.net/nunitaddin/archive/2007/05/16/test-with-silverlight-coreclr.aspx

In addition there’s a full image viewer in here I believe: -
http://www.nikhilk.net/Content/Presentations/MIX07.zip

In fact, I think Nikhil even takes you through building it in this session: -
http://int1.fp.sandpiper.net/soma/applications/silverlight/v1/videos/XD003.wmv

The charting library is to die for. Super easy to build cool, custom widgets.

ActionScript3 is very nicely improved over plain JavaScript (has classes, inheritance, optional static typing and code completion in appropriate IDE – but still preserves all the functional programming of JavaScript).

Well, I have my dev staff do Java in the middle-tier, but you could just as well roll your Flex middle-tier in .NET if that’s your preference.

Already has excellent support across Windows, Mac, Linux, IE, Firefox/Mozilla, Safari.

Heck Flex was looking great a year ago when I was checking it out at JavaOne. By now its very mature and has gone open source.

If you have real projects to do right now, as I do, then Flex is the only choice – fortunately it’s not one to be regretted.

I mention in the article “There’s lots of Beta and Alpha software required to preview Silverlight. I don’t have a problem with most of it because the downloads are small, and the intrusion to installing into the system is minor.” But the gigantic ORCAS is required to compile the included code for some controls — and that is what I have issues with.

Also, you’re right, all someone really needs to get started is the Silverlight Runtime and Silverlight SDK. (2 items). I downloaded all the files from the Silverlight website before I realized what was really needed. I downloaded 2 runtimes, Expression Blend 2 Preview, and 2 SDKs (1.0, 1.1).

Alec G: I don’t disagree with a lot of your comments. My Orcas comment was more geared at compiling the sample controls. And I slam on Orcas being 6 gigs to download. I started playing with Silverlight with a text right away, I’m pretty sure that’s mentioned in the article. Come on, 6 gigs to write text and have some started templates pre-configured should be considered normal for an IDE?

Indeed, I did miss the point about Silverlight, this article covers the learning process. I’ve been reading for weeks on the web how Silverlight and Adobe’s Apollo are going to be competing products. This leads one to make some conclusions. Really, Silverlight competes with Adobe’s Flash, since it’s really geared towards making embeded front-ends for media content in the web-browser. Though, it looks like the Silverlight codecs deliver spectacular video quality — even over a slower Internet connection like mine is.

I’m not going to be waiting for the Mono port. I’d rather go with the Java route.

I’m looking for something that’s somewhere between what Flash is and WPF. Being able to create an application like that NY Times Reader on multiple-platforms would be incredibly powerful for a developer. I’m going to continue my quest and look into QT (Skype was created with this), Mozilla’s XUL (http://www.getdemocracy.com/ has created a really spectacular cross-platform application using XUL and Python that really hits a sweet-spot with me, but there’s a lot of loops to get up and running, also ActiveState’s Komodo IDE was created with XUL), and now I’ll add to that list, Java Swing (I believe blurb.com uses swing for their book development software).

Yeah, I’m complaining a bit, Silverlight is so close to what I need, yet so far away. Surely, if Microsoft can create a cross-platform browser plug-in for Mac, that they could create runtimes that launch
applications natively from the OS that aren’t embedded in a browser? In the future I may still try my idea of creating native code that launches a simple shell app with an embedded web browser that hosts an embedded Silverlight application (though Firefox browser will be required to be installed on the Mac and Windows). Also, where Microsoft is really close in their supporting of Dynamic languages. The DLR is a great thing (in my view). My criticisms are intended to give those in charge of the Silverlight product insight into what some customers are looking for, especially if their product is so close to delivering that. Also, MSFT’s developed so many user input controls for WPF, that I can’t believe it would be terribly difficult for them to include them with the package, though, I know I’m simplifying the problems this could lead to. Alas, it’s proven that this isn’t the product I was looking for, but hopefully I help some other developers out.

What are you talking about? You need one application. one. 4 meg install and your done.

Perhaps you were talking about *creating* Silverlight content. For that you need: the silverlight installer, and Notepad. I’m pretty sure the latter is out of beta.